Well, as far as Frankel and Pletcher go, they don't claim horses, so it is difficult to determine. As TGJB said, the sudden improvement in the numbers is what tells the tale more than the win%. I agree with him whole heartedly there. I was only illustrating Mullins 30% clip to compare it to the strange slumps he goes through, not as proof of juice. And the Asmussen 25% comment was just to relate it to the DRF article. My post was less about offering proof, and was more of a rant designed to generate some discussion.

There is a reason why I post about Mullins, Gill and Norman all of the time. These guys just get such a large immediate improvement from average older horses, it makes you wonder. A lot of the horses Frankel gets privately are young and have a right to improve, so like I said, it's tougher to tell with him.

The problem is, once a newly claimed horse gets the juice and improves for the new connections, you have to assume he is continuing to get the juice. How do we know? There could be new laws pending or a barn raid or something to strike fear into the hearts of these cheaters...enough to cause them to lay off of the "stuff" for a few weeks. How unfair is that to bettors? I wish the Form would just come out and tell us who is getting the juice and when. Imagine seeing a horse claimed by Dutrow Jr. off of some nobody and see the notation (EPO 1) next to the Lasix symbol to show first time EPO. That horse gets claimed by some nobody again and we see no (EPO) notation and the horse reverts back to his old numbers. Wouldn't that make things so much easier???

Also, does anyone find it interesting that some of these juice guys in the claiming ranks (Gill, Mullins) are now starting to change their focus to 2yo's and trying to develop stake winners on their own? It's a little tougher to tell you're using juice when you've had the horse the whole time....just as TGJB mentioned with Master David. It looks a whole lot worse when you claim an 8yo and he starts running new tops for you than if you develop the horse yourself, using the juice all the while. This process is much tougher to decipher since there is no previous form to compare the improvement to.

Overlays to all and to all a good night!!!