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Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (502 Views)
Posted by: Millennium3 (IP Logged)
Date: May 31, 2005 09:14PM

I'll presume the Thorograph calculation of their formula for making figures has been a constant from their beginning (otherwise any horse's improvement couldn't be measured). The Question on this topic then, is: are "figures" (any of them, Thorograph, Beyer, etc.) really an objectively accurate way of assessing a racehorse's quality? Either the method of calculating figures is wrong or off, or the figures are rock solid and rachorses have improved leaps and bounds in the last 10 years.

For the record, I don't know how to calculate figures, nor do I know what goes into Thorograph's calculations. As a buyer of their stuff, I do have questions on "what" factors get weighted, and "how" that's decided. Here's an extrapolated example of the question I have.

The 2004 Thorograph Breeder's Cup Seminar had a single mantra repeated for scores of horses: those "shipping-in" and encountering the "warmer climate" of Texas could be significantly disadvantaged. This mantra was based on the assumption that horses from the east coast in 2003 ran poorly, or below expectations (based on their sheets going in, most probably). The heat wave at Santa Anita in 2003 was given as the central explanation for their poor efforts.

If that's true, then those most disadvantaged by any California-based Breeders Cup would be the Europeans, for no horses come farther or from cooler autumn climates than they do. And the factual evidence of their results tells otherwise: Lashkari, Last Tycoon, Miesque, Arcangues and Spinning World all won in California. If you toss in some brave narrow losses by Theatrical (in '86), Trempolino, and Ski Paradise, it weakens the reasoning further.

In 2003 that same reasoning goes on life support, since the Europeans probably had their best overall showing in a Cup ever: Six Perfections won; Islington-L'Ancresse-Yesterday went 1-2-3 in the Filly Turf; and High Chaparral-Falbrav in the Turf. All done in the stifling heat at Santa Anita.

So, if the weather and shipping were given as precautions to consider for wagering in 2004 (in spite of the evidence), isn't it fair to question Thorograph as to whether the criteria for making figures, or decisions about what to weigh is objective or accurate? I'm asking honestly, not disrespectfully. This is about whether or not figures as such are really relevant.

I worked in racing for a long time. I agree with what I presume is Thorograph's take that perfomances are being medically enhanced. But if this explains the jumps for all or most figures, then why make figures at all, since we'll never know what or how much which horse got of what "medicine"?

It happens even at the cheap tracks where I worked. I saw trainers who couldn't spell the word "horse" suddenly start ripping off wins in spades; one in particular that won more races in one meet than he'd won in the whole 13 years I worked there. Let someone try to convince me he woke up one morning and discovered how to train, or that he just got a world beating bunch of $3,500 claimers. The explanation for that kind of turnaround can only be one thing.



M3



Subject Written By Posted
HOW FAST are horses getting faster (1506 Views) jimbo66 05/31/2005 02:22PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (872 Views) TGJB 05/31/2005 02:48PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (526 Views) jimbo66 05/31/2005 03:00PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (543 Views) 05/31/2005 03:11PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (497 Views) beyerguy 05/31/2005 03:15PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (668 Views) 05/31/2005 03:19PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (530 Views) jimbo66 05/31/2005 03:21PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (521 Views) 05/31/2005 03:38PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (537 Views) jimbo66 05/31/2005 04:31PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (571 Views) 05/31/2005 05:22PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (557 Views) jimbo66 05/31/2005 03:15PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (479 Views) 05/31/2005 03:19PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (542 Views) beyerguy 05/31/2005 03:20PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (559 Views) 05/31/2005 03:30PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (510 Views) TGJB 05/31/2005 03:26PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (598 Views) miff 05/31/2005 04:42PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (570 Views) miff 05/31/2005 04:57PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (578 Views) Michael D. 05/31/2005 05:22PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (551 Views) asfufh 05/31/2005 07:30PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (492 Views) kev 05/31/2005 07:37PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (596 Views) miff 06/01/2005 08:09AM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (549 Views) kev 06/01/2005 06:39PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (493 Views) Michael D. 05/31/2005 07:59PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (600 Views) TGJB 05/31/2005 05:28PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (550 Views) 05/31/2005 07:10PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (674 Views) 05/31/2005 02:48PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (580 Views) Uncle Buck 05/31/2005 04:40PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (519 Views) kev 05/31/2005 06:42PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (516 Views) kev 05/31/2005 06:55PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (502 Views) Millennium3 05/31/2005 09:14PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (502 Views) mikemd 05/31/2005 10:26PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (522 Views) beyerguy 06/01/2005 03:06AM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (501 Views) TGJB 06/02/2005 01:00PM
Re: HOW FAST are horses getting faster (524 Views) 06/02/2005 01:14PM
Beyer Quote (530 Views) 06/02/2005 01:37PM
Re: Beyer Quote (509 Views) TGJB 06/02/2005 01:49PM
Re: Beyer Quote (524 Views) 06/02/2005 02:23PM


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