Since I do find this amusing Jerry, I'll be your huckleberry.

You posted:
Author: TGJB
Date: 03-25-02 11:37

Jim,
You know, I almost was willing to let this go- but then I read it again, and you are just so disgustingly dishonest.

1- "I am not currently, nor have I ever been, an employee of Ragozin." Yet, you claim to know our sales figures, the details regarding Rovine/Burke(which, as you know, resulted from Nebel's complaint), and parrot the party line regarding our supposed lack of financial health.

2- "Your characterization of Nebel... is incorrect." He got barred for doing something dishonest. Straighten me out, and I don't mean splitting hairs about which track he got barred from.

3- "I never said you were losing money on your promotion." No, you IMPLIED it, and said we did it out of desperation, which is a crock.

4- "Check/Cash is the same thing as far as I'm concerned." Then why bring it up? We both know why.

5- "You should get off the kick that you are trying to do something beneficial for Gulfstream and their patrons." I'm running a business, and as such recognize that giving value to the track, my customers, and potential customers, makes them all want to do business with me. I don't believe in charging people to learn how to use a commercial product. As such, the seminars become events that are good promotions for the tracks, and ultimately for us.

6- "Just be honest- I know I would certainly respect you a whole lot more. As it is..." You guys wonder why I'm as angry at the Ragozin operation as I am? This guy either works for them, or has been fed this stuff by them- there is no third choice. And it goes on ALL THE TIME in the field- the only time they take the "high road" is when we are in a position to respond, and the only thing they will never do is compare products.

TGJB

Then I posted:

Author: Jim
Date: 03-25-02 12:35

Jerry, Jerry, perhaps I can negotiate a 2 for 1 discount with the terapist for you and HP. Try this...close your eyes and repeat "Serenity now!!" every 5 seconds. Better?

In answer to your attacks:

1)I thought you knew this, but there are few secrets in the racing industry. I have many friends that are employees at many racetracks. I know several Sheet players. Call me a liar all you want, still doesn't make it true.

2)Follow your lackey HP's thread, the story is there.

3)Uh ok Jerry. If you say so. I was under the impression your product was thrown off the track at Calder year before last due to poor sales. I mean how bad is it when Lawton, who sells $10/day, is allowed to stay and your product got the hook?

4)The point is you HAVE to pay cash for shipping.

5)I call bs. You aren't doing anything for the GP patrons out of the goodness of your heart. You GAVE your product away to promote your product. Ragozin didn't because he doesn't have to (what did I imply there?) - end of story.

6)Once again, I don't work for them and never have. I just got fed up with bs and set you straight. Call me a liar again and we'll see who backs down when push comes to shove.


Come on Jerry, you aren't changing my mind, putting words in my mouth, or getting me to change the subject. I stand by everything I said in the post and you still have not refuted one word. Is offense really your best defense? Let me apologize for saying you are desperate, you obviously are very secure, lol.

I have purposely tried to stay away from bashing/slamming you, but you saying that I am dishonest is crossing the line. Keep it up and this discussion will take a nasty turn, count on it. Ragozin may take the high road, but I have no relationship with them so I don't have to. Your own customers (there are a couple on this thread) tire of your rants against Ragozin - grow up already.

Then your response:

Author: TGJB
Date: 03-25-02 13:50

Jim-
To quote Peter O'Toole(Henry II?)in "A Lion In Winter", "I've won. Surely you noticed."
When we started this site, one of my stated aims was to bring guys like you out from under the rocks and into the open, where both the methods and false accusations of the Raggies would be clear, and the B.S. refuted. In your case we have the added bonus of seeing the breathtaking contempt you have for the intelligence of those following the "debate"- attempts at slippery, Clintonesque(and not even well done)hair splitting(it matters at which track Nebel got banned?).
In any event, we don't pay cash for shipping, not that it would mean anything regarding the value of the product if we did. A long time(8-10 years)ago we did have to, when the company was shaky. We do almost all our business with UPS on the same basis Ragozin does his with FedEx. We do a few packages a week with FedEx, and pay by check. Discussion of this subject says alot more about you, Nebel and the other Raggies than it does about us.
You asked HP if he knew how much Nebel was selling those passes for. Answer- enough to get his ass thrown off track.
Too funny.
Incidentally, are there terapists outside Maryland?

TGJB

My response:

Author: Jim
Date: 03-25-02 14:00

Jerry,

I like how you pick one or two things from my factual replies and try to slide past them but you have done nothing but proven my points. Why exactly did you have to pay cash?

It mattered which track because you were wrong. I know that you would like to me to pass over everything you post incorrectly, but I'm not going to. Once I again I tell you that Nebel was reinstated for the pass "misunderstanding". (doesn't seem to sink in with you guys for some reason though)

Seems you have completely gotten off my original points about Gulfstream, the seminar, and the ThoroGraph Operatives (talk about questionable characters). A victory for me since you didn't say I wrong about any of them...what you don't say says a lot more about you that what you are saying.


After not answering any of my points, you finally gave up and with your final post said:

Author: TGJB
Date: 03-25-02 14:27

Jim-
I have a lot higher opinion of readers here than you do- I'll let this go unanswered. Thank you, and don't be a stranger.

TGJB


So Jerry, you BACKED DOWN, plain and simple. You refused to answer any of the points I raised and in the end layed down like a $10 hooker.

This so much fun - I love seeing lying scum like you squirm.